have any suggestions- pros and cons for painting a brick fireplace that houses an wood stove insert?

Question

My main concern is that the paint would start to peal due to how hot the bicks can get.

Hudson Designs · Answer

Hello Kelly,
I would have to agree about the pealing also the soot will be hard to clean off maybe.
You can buy Fire Retardant paints that will be better for this area.

Woodbridge Environmental Tiptophouse.com · Answer

Painting brick can be easily done using any good quality paint. Although the bricks do get warm, they should never be so hot as to melt any paint surface. 
Just remember however, once painted you can NEVER go back to natural brick look again. 
Also have you considered using stone or tile over the brick?

Kimberly Lacy · Answer

Definitely prime the brick before painting.  And be sure to get quality paint.

Paul M · Answer

Well woodbridge you can go back to the natural brick look but it is a very invasive process. You would have to sandblast the bricks under high pressure with large grit aluminum oxide or silica sand. I have successfully done that before on 100 year old brick with about 4 layers of paint on them. It is a nightmare to say the least but is is doable.

Kelly W · Answer

Has anyone actually have experience painting a brick fireplace that has a wood insert and  is used every day for five - six months out of the year?  I have seen lots of painted fireplaces and they all look great, but most of them are not in regular use.  Ours is and the bricks get pretty hot especially right above the door. What I am actually asking for someone who has done it to give me the thumbs up or thumps down... 
I have considered stone and tile, but before I go that route I would like to try keeping the brick... I really like the look of painted brick.  Thanks.

Woodbridge Environmental Tiptophouse.com · Answer

Paul I agree with you on the removal of the paint, however there is a much easier method. That is to use soda blasting. This process is very much like sandblasting, but the medium uses is baking soda. You can get this material in various grit levels depending on how aggressive you want to be when removing the material in question. The baking soda once it hits the surface it explodes and cuts into just the surface being blasted. The benefit of this is it will not harm the brick. We have used this process to remove age old paint on moldings in homes without damaging the wood. What is really cool about this is that by using drop cloths to catch the debris that falls. Then bringing them outside. We lift the corners and run a garden hose and the soda melts away and goes down the drain. Leaving only the paint and debris left to dispose of. No shoveling of the silica, sand or any other media to dispose of. The disadvantage it that you need a soda blaster device. Although pretty much the same as a sand blaster, it also has air driers, special metering devices and uses at least a 50 hp portable compressor. This link shows a company doing some outside brick and the final results just to get an idea of how this works. We use this method to remove mold on wood framing. When were done, we simply vacuum up the soda and wash it away down the drain. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVwS_UBYhDk&NR=1 Bob

KMS Woodworks · Answer

@woodbridge...thanks for the added knowledge to my knowledge toolbox.

@kelly...We have two wood stoves in our home one is a free standing soapstone unit in the master bedroom that sees a hand full of use each season (when it get REALLY cold) the other is a large insert in our living room that pretty much runs 24 / 7 for the entire winter...which is 6 to 8 months longs at 8500 feet in the Rockies.

The area around our insert is moss rock and we would never think of painting it...it just looks too cool.  Painting your brick sounds like a perfectly acceptable plan to me.  It may get some soiling over the years due to smoke of soot but a touch up coat of paint could fix that.  I would recommend you paint in the summer so the paint will have a few weeks at least to fully cure.  Heat guns are often used to remove paint but those temps are very high...if the area around your insert is getting that hot then you have some other bigger concerns.

Paul M · Answer

Hmm Woodbridge haven't tried that one before. Most of what I have to deal with needs an aggressive touch. I have had to use glass beads from time to time on metal for non destructive cleaning but I doubt that would work very well on wood. We have also use walnut shells to polish stainless steel in a specific configuration. The don't work half the time but that might work on wood too. The place where we get our media never mentioned baking soda. I'll have to ask them about that.

French Remodeling · Answer

Bottom line, it is never a good idea to paint brick! Repair the brick or use something else.

Kelly W · Answer

Thanks for the answers, but I'm still hoping for more ideas.  I don't need to take the paint off, the brick is not broken so no need to fix it and I think there are many good reasons to paint brick... just looking for some opinions by people  who have both painted a brick fireplaces and those fireplaces are use 24/7 for 6 -8 months.

Hudson Designs · Answer

Hello again Kelly,
May I recommend BURN BARRIER Glaze No. 18 It is designed for use over non-combustible substrates, and as a topcoat.
Retardant Two Component Epoxy Coating. It is suitable for both interior and exterior applications. This two component, Class 'A' rated coating has the following outstanding properties; high-gloss finish, hardness, toughness, excellent color retention, as well as having excellent chemical and water resistant
properties. www.fireretardantsinc.com

Paul M · Answer

Kelly I'm sorry but I have met many people that think there are good reasons to paint brick, however I have yet to find one good reason, ever. French is right and you can paint it if you like but I believe you are making a mistake.

Kelly W · Answer

Paul and French perhaps if you saw the fireplce I am talking about you would change your mind... wait, here is a photo for you. hopefully you can enlarge the photo and check out the sculptured brick.

Paul M · Answer

Ok so it is a little sooty but that can easily be remedied with a diluted solution of muriatic acid, rubber gloves and a spray bottle. Of course if you have never done it before I wouldn't recommend you trying it because it can be hazardous but it will make that brick look bright and new very quickly. Maybe you can find someone that is willing to do it for you and of course you will have to contain the mess. Or I guess you could just paint it if you like. Still I wouldn't paint it, but that is just me.

Kelly W · Answer

Thanks for the answers, but I'm still hoping for more ideas.

Kelly W · Answer

the soot is not an issue... I know how to deal with it.  But have you painted a fireplace and from that experience you recommend not painting brick or is it that you just don't like the look?

Woodbridge Environmental Tiptophouse.com · Answer

Paul, you would be amazed at what baking soda media can clean. With some experience, They use this a lot in airplane painting as they can blast all the paint off, hose the plane down and all the media simply melts away so no issue with stuff getting into the control surface areas. Simply mask off the windshield and because its so forgiving the paper on the masking tape is not even damaged.

Kelly, some fireplaces look great painted. The big issue most people have, including myself is that if you do not like it, or at some time later decide you want to change back. Its almost impossible to accomplish and in some cases cannot be done.

I see people all the time painting the outside brick on their homes, although a completely different animal then a indoor fireplace, they quite frankly destroy the ability of the brick to breath and allow for trapped moisture that gets behind the brick to ventilate out and spalling is oftentimes the result. Of course this should never happen to a indoor fireplace but once done, you really can never go back again.

Paul M · Answer

Kelly not only does natural brick look good but I have seen may houses with painted brick where the brick has failed because the paint traps water behind it and the brick never gets to dry out again. Currently I have a home where someone painted the brick fireplace to make it look like brick. That house is 80 years old and this was done long ago. So you can paint it with any high quality paint and it would hold up but in my case I would rather see the natural brick. That fireplace looks like it is fake, you know painted on the wall instead of real. But like Woodbridge just said changing it back is such an ordeal it is not worth it. That would be your question to yourself, will you, or anyone, want to change it back to brick anytime? Consider the long term consequences of what you are planning to do and then just do what ever you decide. It is, after all, your house.

Kelly W · Answer

Like I said the brick looks fake as is... so it wouldn't be removing the natural charm of the old brick... believe me I would leave as is if it had any. we live in a 1880's house but the fireplace I think is from the 30s or 40s. Here is a close up of the ugly brick.

KMS Woodworks · Answer

Kelly

Paint is a quick relatively inexpensive, but have you considered taking it up a notch with tile overlay?  some marble, granite, or slate could give it a completely new look.

Kelly W · Answer

yes, we have considered it... but want to keep it brick.  Have you painted a brick fireplace that is used as a primary heat source? do you have any advice for me based on that experience? Thanks, Kelly

KMS Woodworks · Answer

I have not but I have ripped out some brick veneer that was painted....poorly mind you....brick with all of its nooks and crannies is a very tough paint job (unless it is sprayed) If you have your heart set on painting (which seems apparent from this thread) got for it. Having it 'sprayed' will give the best result. A good cleaning will ensure the paint will adhere properly , keep in mind the final results are only as good as the prep. Here is an article I wrote on Networx about good prep. http://www.networx.com/article/four-painting-shortcuts-that-will-cost-y

Kelly W · Answer

Thanks KMS. I wouldn't say my heart is set on painting it... I will not paint it if I hear from someone who has gone through the experience and advises against it. I'll then look into resurfacing the fireplace... its just that if it can be done successfully  (keeping in mind that the the fireplace is used all the time in the winter and the bricks get very warm... can't leave your hand on them for too long) then I would prefer to paint cause I like the look of painted bricks and it would be the least expensive option...and I can't lie that is appealing!

Patsy W · Answer

Hey Kelly, check out Mike S from Smyrna, Ga...he posted pics of brick fireplace painting using a product 'Brick-Anew Fireplace Kit. Hope this helps!

Paul M · Answer

Ok Kelly you got me that is some weird looking brick. It sort of looks like a pile of worms. I don't think you would go wrong with any good oil based paint. That is what someone painted my fireplace with and it has been on there for at least 50 years. Just use a good primers sealer like Kilz first, the oil based stuff, and you should be fine.

Kelly W · Answer

Thanks Patsy, I saw mike's project and have posted a question for him... It does look like a bunch of worms, Paul,  do use the fireplace that has been painted for at least 50 years?

Woodbridge Environmental Tiptophouse.com · Answer

Any kind of paint that is light colored, regardless of heat resistance or not, will darken slightly when heated. The brick although it gets warm and perhaps to hot to touch, which by the way should not be happening, can be painted.

On the topic of getting hot, you stated that there is a wood stove insert in the opening. Has the brick face surround been checked by a professional chimney person? If your experiencing the heat build up from the insert, there are some very strict rules that apply to the clearance of the brick to the frame structure that surrounds the original fireplace. 
The brick should not be in direct contact with the wood framing at all. Heat that can be generated by an insert can travel through the brick face and cause charring of the framing members within the wall. As wood chars so does its ability to ignite into flame.

Also a proper wood stove insert should not be conveying any heat back towards the wall surface. Its very design is that to deliver the radiant heat out and away from the wall. 
I would suggest that you check on the installation and underwriters laboratories approval for this appliance to be sure your not risking your home due to fire.

The purpose of the brick face is to eliminate any materials that are prone to combustion next to the fire box. The brick if done correctly should be kept about one inch away from any combustible materials unless the entire structure is make of cement, brick and blocks. When free standing wood stoves are installed and a brick wall is constructed to act as a heat shield codes require a one inch air gap between the back of the bricks and the wall. Not all fireplace fronts that have inserts installed meet these requirements.

For your safety, please check this out. We want you to be around for some future questions. 
Bob

Kelly W · Answer

no worry,  Its all to code... we made sure of that and it was professionally installed. and the fireplace is all brick no wood! The bricks above the insert get hot because the air is being brown back into the room and the air naturally raises thus heating the bricks. That being said we have thought of pulling the stove insert out about five more inches so that the blower isn't blowing right on the brick (which to be honest has always seemed a bit strange to us.)  But moving it out five more inches would mean that it would sit some on the hearth... is that a good idea?

Woodbridge Environmental Tiptophouse.com · Answer

Ideally no, your hearth is not designed to hold any real weight nor is it really how a fireplace insert is designed to be installed. 
I am glad you had this issue addressed. I cannot tell you how many homeowners do not do this and they suffer damaging results because of this.

If the heat is rising up and washing on the front of the brick, have you thought of having a small metal shield made from local HVAC contractor perhaps out of 18 gauge steel that can be placed along the top and have it bent in such a way to direct the heat out from the wall?  It can be bent not quite as much as a L shape and insert the bottom of the L into and between the top of the insert and bottom of the fireplace box. Paint it black to match the stove and this should cure your excessive heat going up the wall.

Kelly W · Answer

sounds like that would work, thanks for the advise, really appreciate it! Kelly

have any suggestions- pros and cons for painting a brick fireplace that houses an wood stove insert?

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have any suggestions- pros and cons for painting a brick fireplace that houses an wood stove insert?

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