Atlanta, GA on Oct 05, 2011

I recently had a very bad experience with a flooring guy who I trusted for many years.

He had done great work for us in the past. He said he could level our basement floor and do a polished concrete floor. Well, the floor is not level and it is breaking apart. the more and more I get advice and talk to other professionals, it is clear that he did a terrible job, used the wrong materials and has no liability insurance. He said he would demo the floor, but he will not give us our money back. Any advice?

32 Comments Displaying 25 of 32 comments | See Previous

Kim N Atlanta, GA

He is not licensed, bonded or insured or this would not be a big issue. What are the best steps in taking legal action or resolving this outside of court?

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Kim N Atlanta, GA

I have been talking to Amazing Improvements and he has been wonderful. He looked up the material this guy used and sent Tim Hudson over to evaluate the situation. he said it was the worst he has ever seen.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 1
KMS Woodworks Nederland, CO

just curious as what he used...and can you post some pics?

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Kevin M. Veler, Law Offic... Alpharetta, GA

Kim, not all contractors need to be state licensed. Unfortunately there is a lot of deception out there because many specialty contractors merely say "licensed". Those may constitute false business practices but there are no published decisions that I am aware of. If the contractor was required to be state licensed (lets say, for a remodel) and was not, then under GA law, that contractor cannot enforce his contract against you. That does not automatically get your money back, although ...»
I have successfully argued and won a case in Cobb to demand a full refund and the Court agreed. Even if you get a judgment, you may not get paid. There's a lot of variables to know what strategy may work best and how to get the money back but that is always more difficult than a battle when you have not paid the contractor. Hope this helps.
Magistrates Court has a $15,000 limit in GA. These websites may be of help and there are other links on my website.

http://www.georgiacourts.org/councils/magist...
http://consumer.georgia.gov/consumer-topics/...

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 1
Glkirk Builders Inc. Chesapeake, VA

Licensing is for the purpose of gaining revenue at the local level and accountably at the state level.Did you check either of these?
Bonding is monies put up by the contractor to guarantee he will perform. Did you require him to post a bond?
Liability insurance covers accidental damage at a job site, bodily or material. Workers Comp ...»
insurance covers workers hospital and disability costs. Did you require these certificates directly from his agent, so that your homeowners policy is not responsible?
I don't know of any insurance that covers poor or improper work.
If you can't first try to get the problem resolved, you can get a court date and see what a judge thinks.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Kevin M. Veler, Law Offic... Alpharetta, GA

GLKirk is correct in noting that at the local level, a business license is a occupational tax license. Anyone can get one and they are required to have one. A GA State Contractors license is a professional license and means that the contractor has passed certain test, experience and other requirements to qualify for a state contractor's license.
Liability insurance often does not cover poor or improper work (but it may at times cover the ...»
consequences, such as causing a fire that burns down your home).

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Glkirk Builders Inc. Chesapeake, VA

Licensing, bonding and insurances are not always guarantee that you will get a good job the first time.
Good contractors sometimes have a problem with maybe a new procedure (or at least new to him).
Just because your contractor was good at other carpentry or masonry jobs, doesn't mean he is expert in ALL facets. ...»

It sounds like you thought he could do anything and was let down.
This is where proper planning , discussions and bidding (beforehand) should have been utilized.
Sorry you are going through a rough time.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 1
Kim N Atlanta, GA

To answer your questions, no, we were not very diligent in checking into his background. This was because he had done so much work for us in the past that was great. We trusted him. Do courts often side with the homeowner? Even if they do, how do we make sure he pays? We only paid him 2,700 so far. Now we are paying for a demo, more storage costs and to redo the whole thing.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Bob and RodMan S Tucker, GA

If you decide to go the small claims route contact your local clerk of court for details on procedures, accumulate all the documentation and photos you can but go in knowing that getting a judgement and getting compensation are vastly different events. This, unfortunately, is a reminder that even folks we have had good experiences with can "go South." Got to build in protection in every contract.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Kevin M. Veler, Law Offic... Alpharetta, GA

Technically courts don't side with any particular party. However, judges are human. Perhaps they experience a bad project or their brother-in-law is a contractor and they have either good or bad feelings about the industry, that may have some unintended viewpoint. Nonetheless, magistrate's court is often for litigants who do not have attorney's (but they can or they can be helped to prepare their case with an attorney). Getting a judgment does not mean that you are given a stack of ...»
cash at the end. You still have to collect it. But you may end up settling in meantime or you may have to take further effort. I have a client in Paulding Co who I helped obtain a $12k judgment against the unlicensed contractor. She was recently surprised to actually have recovered $5k by garnishing a bank account we discovered.
Unfortunately when projects go bad, homeowners can be stuck with a lot of additional costs that they may not be able to recover. I know in your case, the horse is out of the barn, but we strongly urge research up front. Even the best research however is not a guarantee that things won't go wrong.
One caveat: I generally do NOT recommend posting a lot of information regarding a potential legal action on a public website which includes specific information. For all you know, the contractor may be reading these responses. I'll be glad to spend 15-30 minutes with you on the phone to see if there is a case and what I can do to help. HOMETALK is great for getting construction and home projects and in seeking help on the technical issues for your project - including whether demo is actually needed or are there other viable options,

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 2
Kim N Atlanta, GA

Thank you.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Micci S Roswell, GA

Could it possibly be that he had done so much work for you in the past that he was trying to "please" you? and didn't quite know what he was getting himself into with a new product?
These are sometimes tough lessons learned. I don't know that there is any real recourse, other than, "OK, I learned from that one."

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 3
Hewitt Remodeling Service... Virginia Beach, VA

Kim,
We are all saddened that this happened to you. Many members have posted good information on how to prevent it from happening again... some of it sounds like "you should haves.." which doesn't make you feel any better about it...that is not our intention.
I suspect that very few of us have never been taken in one form or another by someone that had ...»
proven they could be trusted, and then let us down... it certainly is not limited to home improvement work. It may not have been the guilty party's intent...but it ended up that way.
You are at that dollar value that really makes going after this gent for some sort of financial relief questionable. May want to consider cutting your losses, let it go and chaulk it up to experience.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 1
Micci S Roswell, GA

Oh yeah...and Yamini is right, concrete is absolutely like working in a chemistry lab!

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Kim N Atlanta, GA

Thank you everyone who has talked to me about this situation. I have learned a huge lesson. Thank you to Kevin Veler for talking to me about my situation. He was wonderful and very helpful.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Kim N Atlanta, GA

Photos of the floor
on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
JL Spring & Associates Richmond, VA

A lot of that would have probably not happened if he'd added the Nycon fiberglass to the mix! I'll never pour without it! Best wishes! JL
on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 0
Hudson Designs Loganville, GA

I hate to say anything, Kim said it for me. The photos just can't relate the texture. It is far from any self leveling or smooth trowel finish and by sounding test it has little to no bond to the lower concrete.

on Oct 06, 2011 · Like 1
Amazing Improvements and ... Marietta, GA

It made me sick when she called and the story began to unravel. Based on our discussions, there was a 3rd party involved, brought in by her trusted contractor. This is where it all began to fall apart. The demo of the floor would be a good step by the original contractor as it would save/regain a good portion of what was already spent.

on Oct 10, 2011 · Like 2
HandyANDY Home Renovation... Marietta, GA

It's very hard when clients have a history of working with a particular contractor...and the previous work was good...but then he takes on something outside his expertise to which the client is told "sure...I can do that." I think most of us contractors have done that...myself included but HandyANDY has always made good on it. You want to trust in the relationship and you can't. It sounds like he was acting as a GC or residential contractor here...did you know he was subbing this out? ...»
You'd win but there's no point to it really...2% is getting the judgment...98% is collecting on it...which is next to impossible with most contractors. I'm sorry for your troubles...you've got some good contractors here who can help you. Concrete is a very specialized area and best left to those who do it on a regular basis. At least you'll get it right this time....

on Oct 10, 2011 · Like 1
Kim N Atlanta, GA

I have to say that Tim Hudson and Gary from Amazing Improvements have been the most helpful people I have ever encountered and have gone above and beyond in helping me figure this out.

on Oct 10, 2011 · Like 2
HandyANDY Home Renovation... Marietta, GA

You'll find some phenomenal contractors and contributors on Hometalk...many will go out of their way to help you...just sorry you got into this situation but at least you have good help to get it resolved!

on Oct 10, 2011 · Like 1
Hudson Designs Loganville, GA

I am glad to hear that Kim, we try!
Let us know if we can be of further assistance in this matter.
Gary is looking forward to helping you with the new overlay done right.

on Oct 10, 2011 · Like 0
Amazing Improvements and ... Marietta, GA

Kim, thanks for the kind words. There are a lot of good contractors in the area. Unfortunately, we are spending a disproportionate amount of time unraveling more and more of these situations.

on Oct 11, 2011 · Like 0
HandyANDY Home Renovation... Marietta, GA

It's a huge problem. You have alot of either inexperienced people trying to enter our field because they are out of work....OR you have experienced contractors in one area trying to do work in another just to stay busy. Recipe for disaster in both. Kim was just using someone she already knew which is what many of our clients do. All of this is complicated by many homeowners looking for the lowest price...and that honestly isn't the way to go. Look for long term reputation, contractors ...»
with signage, shirts with their company names, clean records with BBB and groups that have been in your area working for at least the past 5 years. Doing this still won't guaranty a perfect job but it will minimize the risks. Way to go Tim & Gary!

on Oct 11, 2011 · Like 3

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